Trump's Plan For Election Night Riots & The War on Police | Jeanine Pirro | POLITICS | Rubin Report
08:17 "... I believe it was 1994 and that Bronco chase. ..."

About Dave Rubin: http://daverubin.com/- I knew that at some point he had to admit that he was going to use it. But I said, "Why not now?" And he said, "It's not ready yet. This isn't the time yet." So I think what he is preparing for is something really big on election night. (soft serene music) - I'm Dave Rubin and this is "The Rubin Report". Quick reminder everybody to subscribe to our YouTube channel, so you actually get notified of our new videos. And joining me today is a former New York State prosecutor and judge: host of "Justice with Judge Jeanine" on Fox News and author of the new book "Don't Lie to Me: And Stop Trying to Steal Our Freedom". Judge Jeanine Pirro, welcome to "The Rubin Report". - Well it's a pleasure to be with you and on the other end actually. And I really appreciate you plugging my book right off the bat. In fact, I have it right here behind me right under "Don't Burn This Book". So it as you could see you know, it's a 50/50 here. People will decide your book or my book. Probably your book. - No, no, no, no, no. This is gonna be all about your book and I have to tell people a couple insider things before we fully start here. Because although we have not met in real life yet because of this COVID ridiculousness, I've been doin' your show a bunch and I feel like we have this kinship even though we haven't actually broken bread yet or anything. And one of the things that strikes me about you is I do a lotta the Fox shows and on no other show does the host call the guest before, but you call me when I'm usually on Saturdays when you're live. You call me in the afternoon, you ask how I'm doin' and then you always say, "And what's on your mind? What are you thinkin' about? What's goin' on?" And that strikes me as just very different than how all of cable news is done that you're just really interested in talking about what people really care about. Is that fair to say, Judge Jeanine? How is that for a first question? - Well first of all, it was very informative because I have no idea how the other people do their shows on Fox. But what I can tell you is maybe it's my background that speaks to who I am. I am a little different from those people on Fox. I mean I've been a prosecutor, a judge and a DA. For 32 years, I ran for office five times. I mean I have a different background and a different skillset. And to this day, I'll say I need a good witness for this one. And you know, it's not a witness it's against obviously. But I really think it's important that people come on a show and talk about what's important to them. And as long as we have an intersection where it's important to me and I believe then to the public that that's your passion, you know? That's what you're interested in, then you literally jump off the screen. Because to me, passion is everything. And I've long believed and I tried jury trials. I was a litigator for many years and it's what moves me. It's what moves people. So I didn't know any of that or that other people didn't do that, but I always like to get a sense of what you wanna talk about and where your head is. I don't rely on other people to screen my guests. That's not what I do. - Yeah. Do you like doin' the TV stuff more than bein' a prosecutor or bein' a judge or do you just think it's exercising like a different skillset or somethin' like that? - Well you gave me a great outright there, exercising a different skillset. But the truth is the best job in the world was being a prosecutor, Dave. I mean without a doubt and I'll tell you why. I don't mean a prosecutor in the sense that you know, you're out there and you know, lockin' people up. No, being a prosecutor to me was about making victims whole again. It leads to the extent that you can. It might even be just the victim's families. But you know, when I first started prosecuting crimes, I became an assistant DA in 1975 which you know, my kids will tell you that's when they wrote the laws on stone tablets and stopped counting my age. I see your eyes. (vocalizes) And it was like the victims were nothing more than an element of the case, the people of the State of New York against John Smith, all right? But to me, the victim was the reason we were there. The victim was the person who never chose to be a victim, who never chose to be the system in the first place. And so my energies were trying to make that victim whole again, whether the victim was a five year old who had been raped and didn't know the language you know, just said "Peachy pie. My honey bun." And teaching them with anatomically-correct dolls, how they could communicate with a jury or a senior citizen who ended up losing you know, her house because she was a victim of economic crimes. So that to me was my passion and I did it for many decades. I went to the bench. Because to be a judge you know, it's supposed to be the citadel or the practice of law. Hogwash, it's not. I felt like a referee. I felt that when I was a judge sitting on the bench you know, I would sustain an objection, overrule an objection. They'd come up to me and they'd argue and I wanted to be in the fight. You know, it's not really my personality. So I had a tenure term and after three years, I said I've had enough of this and I ran for judge. I was the first woman judge in the history, a county judge in the history of the county. And I said, "I can't take this anymore. This is too slow for me." And I remember that I spoke to the chief administrative judge. And I said, "You know, judge? While I'm taking a plea with one defendant, if you could have the court officers bring another defendant outta the bullpen, his lawyer can talk to him. And then as soon as this plea is over, he's ready to plea or whatever the motion could be." And I thought I was so sharp, right? And I'd move things along. I said, "I could handle twice the cases." And his response was, "Are you tryin' to make the men look bad, Jeanine?" (Dave chuckling) And you know, I didn't take it personally. But I thought to myself whether this is sexist or not, doesn't matter. This is not the speed that I work at. So I stepped off the bench and I ran for district attorney because I was a fighter. I started the first domestic violence unit in the country. You know, first hate crimes unit in the history of my county, sex crimes unit and worked with you know, John Cardinal O'Connor in trying to make sure that everyone was covered under hate crimes. It wasn't just you know, gender and ethnicity and color but sexual orientation as well. And as president of the DA's Association, John Cardinal O'Connor who was beloved in New York, went in and supported that and it became part of New York law. So where I saw problems, I was able to move the legislature. If I had enough support believe me, I don't think singularly I could. But I could do something to try to make a difference. Where I saw victimization, I would go out there and publicly say with the advent of the internet, your kids cannot use the PC as a babysitter. And I started the first internet pedophile sting operation in the nation and we arrested doctors, lawyers, priests, coaches, school superintendents, CEOs, you name it. And it was very satisfying for me. But I gave that job update because I felt that I had done it enough and it was kind of like my own self-imposed term limits. But without a doubt, it was the best job in the world. - So what brought you to cable news? I mean as if you hadn't had enough fights in the courtroom and then runnin' for prosecutor you know, all of this. DA and all that, it's like what? I mean there's no fight like a cable news fight. - Well I must tell you that for whatever reason I got involved in television and it was the OJ Simpson case. I believe it was 1994 and that Bronco chase. And I remember I had just become the DA and I had you know, all 150 assistant DAs at my home. And one of the guys came out, I think it was one of the investigators. He said, "Hey boss, you're not gonna believe it. OJ Simpson's in a Bronco. They're chasin' him." I said, "What are they chasing him for? Is he speeding?" Nobody knew. But that was really the advent of you know, my introduction into the importance of the media in identifying and trying to you know, change certain issues in our society. So for battered women you know, I started the first unit in the nation under the Department of Justice. And people kept thinking battered women. Sex is better for them after their beaten or they deserved it or you know, "She's a pain in the ass." And you know, as a woman assistant DA, I had to deal with 43 male police chiefs in my jurisdiction and deal with that kind of... There was a discrimination. The thinking was marriage is forever, be a better wife. If he's beating you, be a better wife. Go pray. And so we were part of a change. It made a tremendous difference. But I saw the importance in the media. And as a prosecutor, I used the media to help me identify issues and get more victims to come forward. - So just hearing your history a little bit and some of this stuff I actually didn't know, does it drive you crazy when people say, "Oh, conservatives are anti-women," or "Conservatives are anti-gay," or "Conservatives are racist"? Or the rest of it. We've talked a little bit about that on your show. But when you hear some of the things that you've been involved in, it's kinda crazy that people get these labels on 'em. - And you know, the movie that they made about Roger Ailes and the women of Fox who had all these issues and for any victim. Anyone is truly a victim. Remember as a prosecutor, I had to decide is it real? Is it credible? Is it believable? Does it make sense? You know, my heart goes out to them and my passion went out to them along with my energy. But in the movie that they made and I never saw it, they portrayed me as someone who was, as I understand it, apologetic for you know, the offenders. - Yeah, yeah. - And it made me crazy, Dave. It made me nuts. I said to myself for all those #MeToo women, where the hell were you in the late 70s and the early 80s when I was fighting for children to testify? Where the hell were you when I was trying to make it illegal to put women on a lie detector test to claim that they were raped? Where were you when I was fighting to make sure that women couldn't be judged because they wore a short skirt which then allows a defense attorney to say, "You were askin' for it"? You wear a Rolex. If you're burglarized Dave or someone robs you, they're not gonna say, "Hey, you wore that Rolex 'cause you want it to be robbed." But a woman wears a short skirt, "She wore that skirt 'cause she wanted to be raped." You know, it makes me crazy because I've spent my life fighting for the silent victims of crime, for women, for the elderly, for children. People have no idea what happens to children in our system today. You know, I started getting reports of suspected child abuse in the late 70s and they said to me, "You're not entitled to those." I said, "Yes, I am." I mean there's a certain benefit to naivete. In my moral core said, "Bologna, of course you are." And they said, "No, these are privileged. They stay with social services." So I had an all-out war and I was gonna sue the Department of Social Services. I went to the DA and he says, "Oh, let little Jeanine. Let her go do her social things." And it turned out, I said to them, "Look, if a social worker goes and finds that a child is maybe being abused but returns the child to the parents, that record is then expunged. And maybe if they're called again and they don't find anything, that record is expunged. But the third time the kid is dead, okay? I want the first record and the second record and don't you dare tell me that I can't get a history of abuse in a criminal case when I've got the homicide of that child." And I did child abuse homicides, that was one of my expertise. Whether it's shaken baby syndrome, immersion in scalding water, being beaten to death. I mean I can tell you stories that'd make your hair stand. And I don't talk about it often, Dave. And I don't know, you just kinda hit a thing in my head. Very rarely do people even know what I did other than, "Oh she was the DA, whatever that means." But no, I have a passion and I have an empathy for the victim. The victim was everything to me. Why do we name the system, Dave? Think about this. The criminal justice system. It should be the victim justice system. The victim never wanted to be a part of this. But all of a sudden like a thunderbolt, their lives are changed and the ripple effect to their family and the community, it's enormous and you know, what we're seeing today is just an example of all that craziness. - So when you hear people talk about systemic racism that is in our criminal justice system. Well I guess first, do you think that exists? And if it does exist, can you gimme an example of it or a time that you came up against it? - I absolutely do not believe there's systemic racism. I think that the laws are in place to protect everyone and I watched those laws evolve over the years. But in terms of what I've done, lemme be real clear about this. Are there bad cops? Yes, absolutely. Have I prosecuted bad cops? Yes, absolutely. Did I like it? I didn't really like it or dislike it. It was the only way to handle it. I prosecuted an off-duty New York City police officer for shooting an African American over a parking space in Westchester. Dave, to this day, that guy who was the cop. I convicted him. He was convicted. My office convicted him. He was convicted and he went to prison for 25 years. To this day, these guys are after me for doing that. Now I had no idea. But Al Sharpton who I knew 'cause I ran for office you know, so many times. Al Sharpton wanted to make a visit. He called my secretary, at the time there were secretaries and she said, "Boss, Al Sharpton wants to visit you with a few reverends." I said, "Why not?" You know, that's fine. So they came in one morning after the verdict about three or four days and they brought in pastries and we made coffee for them. And you know, I sat and I kinda waited for a second. And they said, "We wanna thank you." And I said, "For what?" And they said, "Never in the history of New York has a white cop been convicted of killing a black man." And I didn't realize that it was historic. Am I proud of it? No, I'm not proud of it. I'm not ashamed of it. It was a horrible thing that happened, but it was the right thing to do. But to this day when the NYPD gave me an award two years ago, that guy's friends, the white cop's friends from New York City, they're still after me. I have a radio show WABC. They call me up to say, "You're this and that," you know? And then I just go like that. They get rid of the call. But I've come across a lot of cases that were ugly. But if your moral core is strong, if you know who you are, if you're not a weak link, then it's easy. You do what you have to do. - So actually I wasn't gonna ask you this, but I think it's sorta the perfect segue before we get to the book. So speakin' of moral core in doin' what you think is right and all that, you're a New Yorker. As you know, I'm born-and-bred New Yorker until I moved out to Cali eight years ago, so I've only lived in New York and California. What is it do you think about New York? Like you strike me as such a New Yorker, like in the best sense of what New York is, you know? People think if you're from New York and Cali, you're crazy. But I mean New York in just sort of the ethnic makeup of New York and the no BS and call it as it is and all that. Can you just tell me a little bit about just like your family makeup and where some of that came from? - Okay, sure. I'd be happy to. I'm of Lebanese descent. I don't know if you even knew that. Everyone assumes because I married an Italian and my name is Jeanine. - Italian. Yeah, I thought you were a purebred off-the-boat from Sicily. - No, no. I'm Lebanese Christian, both my mom and dad. My dad fought in World War II. He was not first generation. My grandfather fought in World War II, but I'm 100% Lebanese Christian. We kept the subculture alive. I cook the food. I cook hummus, tabbouleh and baba ganoush; You know, the grape leaves. I do all that stuff. But I'm gonna surprise you. I grew up in a small town in upstate New York and I worked in a dairy as a young kid. You know, people say to me, "Are you from the Bronx? Are you from (drowned out by poor audio)?" No, actually I'm from Elmira. And they're like, "Where is that?" And in fact Dave for the longest time, I had potbelly pigs in my yard here in Westchester. You know, the pigs. (imitates pig snorting) Those pigs. - Yeah, yeah. - And one lived I think it was 16 years. I mean I just liked farm animals. You know, upstate New York is more like middle America, you know? I learned how to shoot a gun. Church was important. Education was important. I'm the first one in my family to go to college. And you know, it was a very simple, very simple life. Nothing complicated about it. And my mom passed last year in the room right above us here. I had her in hospice. You know, she was everything. She gave me you know, the moral compass to both empathize and she gave me that heart for victims. You know, they just weren't people that you prosecuted for. They were your family. And yet the tough side of me came from being a prosecutor. You know, I was the first woman that went out on a homicide review. And you know, I remember the first time I went out on a homicide call. I went out. You know, like the first thing I said you know, laugh. The call comes in of course at 3:00 in the morning. Homicides only happen at 3:00 in the morning. So after they have an argument with my then-husband that he was gonna get his wife and they kept saying, "No, we want the assistant DA," 'cause I was the first. (chuckles) So yeah, I say to my husband after they tell me the location. I say, "What do you wear to a homicide?" (laughs) So I'm like, "Oh god, what a dumb thing to say." He said, "It doesn't matter what you wear, Jeanine. Just take the penal law along with you." So when I got there, they didn't wanna let me on the scene. And I said, "No, no. I'm really an assistant DA." I was like 25 years old. So yeah, it's been an interesting career. I'm very, very lucky I had a simple life to deal with this complicated world. - I'm pretty sure the title of your next book is "What Do Ya Wear to a Homicide?" I think we got that right there. Oh and by the way, for the record I do know Elmira because I went to SUNY, Binghamton. - No. - So I know a little bit. I know a little bit about the southern tier, yeah. - Oh my gosh, WENY? - Yeah. - Do you remember WENY? - Of course I do. - Did you ski? - Not well, I could fall down a mountain pretty decently. - Yeah? Oh my gosh. Yeah. My grandfather lived in Binghamton anyway. - Yeah, all right. So let's shift a little bit here. I know that this interview right now is obviously your biggest interview of the week. But a few days ago, you did sit down with this other guy. I'm sure some of my audience has heard about him before. This Donald Trump fella. I'm sure some people have heard of him. Can you just tell me a little bit sorta like what is the preparation as an interviewer to do that? I know you have a relationship and you know, he calls in and all that kinda stuff. But like just what's it like sittin' down with the guy and try to just make sense of the world with him right now? - You know, as you said I've known Donald Trump for about 35 years. My then-husband Al who answered the phone and fought with his sergeant who kept saying, "I'm not the assistant DA, Jeanine is," represented Donald for years. So we spend time, most weekends going to Florida with Donald when my kids were little and his kids were little, so I know the man. I know Donald Trump, the man. I have a sense of you know, who he is and I know a side of him, not the caricature that they make them out to be. I know that he's brilliant. But to answer your question directly, how do you sit down and prepare for it? First thing you do is you figure out topics what do you wanna talk to him about? The biggest issues right now are the pandemic, the rioting and the looting, the election, the debate. Joe Biden: is he capable? And the things that no one was talking about that I thought was so important were the Nobel Peace Prize. I mean the Abraham Accords just signed. I mean talk about Israel, the United Arab Emirates, Israel and Bahrain. I mean this is big stuff. And you know, apparently the Saudis are about to follow. So I talked to him about that and I write my questions out. And you know, I've never talked to anyone else at Fox on how they do it. It's almost like you're trying a case, you know. But it's your direct case, it's not really a cross-examination. But you know that you're gonna have to push a little bit. So there are two questions where I pushed. One question was, Look, I said something like, "Mr. President, I know that you have to be invited into certain areas in order to bring in the National Guard as you did in Milwaukee and as you did in Kenosha. But there are some places they will just not have you in and they'd rather see rioting and looting. The word is that on election night assuming that there's a winner. And if you win, if you are the winner and there are the promised riots, looting and anarchy, what will you do?" He said, "We'll put it down very quickly." "What will you do?" "We're gonna put it down very quickly." "What will you do?" He said, "Insurrection." He's gonna use the Insurrection Act. And you know, I knew that at some point he had to admit that he was going to use it. But I said, "Why not now?" And he said, "It's not ready yet. This isn't the time yet." So I think what he is preparing for is something really big on election night. Where were you on election night? Do you remember 2016? - Yeah, I was on air on the Daily Wire with Ben Shapiro and the crew over there. My one takeaway of the night. I don't know if you know Andrew Klavan who's one of the hosts on the Daily Wire. He said something that I thought was really brilliant that night. He said, "Only in America could the thing that everyone said couldn't happen, could happen." And I thought well all right, whether you love Trump or hate Trump, the fact that something like that can happen, that all the pundits could get it wrong, all the pollsters could get it wrong, all the elites could get it wrong. That's actually pretty beautiful that that goes to the strength of our democracy actually. - You know, and it really does go to the strength of our democracy that it's not so predictable. It's not so set in stone. It's not as though people are orchestrating it. I remember coming out of the Hilton on election morning. It was like 3:30 or 4:00 in the morning and I was just so excited. I mean I think Buzzfeed, one of 'em had a picture of me standing on a chair with a Trump hat on and I had the loudest dress I could wear. It was like orange flowers or something. And so I'm like dancin' outta the hotel and all of a sudden somebody starts cursin' at me. And you know and I look down and I look up, the guy's like six four and he's cursin' me out. And you know, not a shy New Yorker. I went right back at him who was taller than me. Although he was in a tutu, but he was really tall. So the cop said to me, "Judge, come over here." I said, "No, make him go over there." You know, I'm really stupid sometimes. - [Dave] (chuckles) You're a New Yorker. - Yeah. (laughs) Whatever the reason is, I was stupid. And so then they start. Another guy started coming out cursing, "She's a Trump person." So the reason I bring it up is I guarantee you that 2020 if the president is announced as the winner that night, it's gonna be wild. I truly believe he will win. I think that even people, Dave, in those towns where there's anarchy like Portland and Seattle. And I know those are liberal states, like Oregon and all that. But there are people now who are afraid. They're afraid. They survived kinda the pandemic and they have one shot to get back their business which is the security for their family, which is their ego, their sense of self, their sense of self-worth. Our jobs are who we are. And (claps) bang, the protesters come in and destroy it. I don't think they want the left controlling that and getting away with impunity. This is impunity. But it's not one thing, Dave. It's not like all of a sudden it was a perfect storm that George Floyd died and you know, everybody said, "All right, let's revolt." No, you don't find bricks in the middle of a pandemic, right? Nobody's building anything in Manhattan. And all of a sudden all over the country, there's no bail statutes. So everyone who's being arrested is being let out. And even the ones who are being arrested, they've now got prosecutors who have been elected with the support of the Democrat socialists of America who are saying, "We're not prosecuting them. We're not putting people in jail. We're letting people out of jail." And so now this whole layer that we haven't even noticed is on fire and it is set for a huge turnaround. And this is the last chance we have in this country to secure law and order. - All right, so that brings us to the book because I read a bunch of it this morning. And the opening of the book in essence, you say, "This is a battle of good and evil." And you know, I've sort of come around to that. Like I don't like thinking that my ideological enemies are evil and I think a lot of them have good intentions. But I think in effect at this point, this thing that we're fighting that you're talkin' about, this Marxist revolution and Antifa and BLM and this whole thing, it has become evil even if some of them do have good intentions. Do you really believe that this is sort of the last stand? You know, we always say this is the most important election ever. But do you really feel like this is it, like this is the final stand? - You know, you're right. We always say it. People always say, "This is the most important election in your lifetime." I really mean it this time. I mean I would take an oath on this. You know, I would go to church on this because there's so much at stake and we're right at the precipice where it'll all fall. I spent 32 years in law enforcement in the courts in the criminal justice system. I know that. That is my wheelhouse. And what is happening now is with the defunding of police, with the stand-down police orders, with the no bail, with prosecutors who are refusing to prosecute. What we've got now is total anarchy. And when the left talks about open borders, locking you down, defunding the police. And when Kamala Harris says the Constitution doesn't stop her from taking away our guns, we got real problems. We've got real problems. And you know what I think? I think not just the people who live in the cities that have been destroyed: Milwaukee, Kenosha which is small-town America, Milwaukee and Chicago and Seattle and Portland and Detroit. Not Detroit so much, they're in good shape. But Washington and so many cities, New York City. I mean the Democrats know what they need and they need law enforcement. They need criminal justice. People in the inner city know that the vast majority of victims of crime are black-on-black crime, okay? They know they need protection. And so the black reverends, the Hispanic pastors and all that other stuff, priests, they want law enforcement in the community. But the criminals are now in bold and I'm not telling you anything you don't already know and that you talk about, Dave. But this is the last chance. People are walking around with guns in their waistbands. They're not worried about anything. Because just as I unearthed, there was a memo the DA in Manhattan, Cy Vance, handed out right after one of the huge protests which involved looting and burning an anarchist and all kinds of theft. The DA comes out in his internal memo to his staff and he says, "We're gonna give the protestors." They're protesters. Mind you, they're protestors. - [Dave] Yeah, protestors. - "Give them ACDs or dismissals. But if any of those protestors have any information about police misbehaving in their arrests or mishandling them, we will take those cases and prosecute them. So let the protestors go and turn the tables on the cops." Really? Two cops in Compton. You know, I mean I'm sick. I'm sick. People laughing. People laughing. A woman shot through the jaw trying to say what her number is. This is not America. - How worried are you that the state of the system because of everything that you just described there that in a certain way it almost has to get worse before it can get better that you can't get a reset when you have so many sort of cowardly DAs? Now cowardly. I don't blame a lotta the police chiefs or the average policeman who's retiring early. I don't blame him. It's like if you're not gonna be backed up by your politicians, I don't blame them. But do you think it has to get worse because enough of them will have to disappear and maybe you have to then vote in completely new politicians, most likely Republicans without complete chaos happening, that it can't reset otherwise? - Well I think two things. I think number one, it has to get worse and it will get worse, okay? There's no question. The president is not gonna use insurrection unless it does get worse. He said the time is not now. And I also think that these. (dogs barking) I'm so sorry. I have a few dogs. - [Dave] You got your own interaction over there. - Yeah, I'm so sorry. But I also think that these politicians, these prosecutors are in. I mean they're not gonna be voted out for a few years. But the money that's coming in to support Antifa, outside money and the money that's coming in to fund these people flying from one city to another city where they're bailed out in one city to then go to another city. I mean there's big money behind the destruction of this count

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