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Dave Rubin of The Rubin Report talks to Sebastian Gorka, Sean Spicer, and Jack Murphy about what the future holds for Trump supporters, the MAGA platform, and whether or not there will be a Trump 2024. Did Trump supporters storming the capitol put an end to the Trump movement as we knew it? Are there other politicians waiting to pick up the “make America great again” mantle to get Trump voters? Will the Trump impeachment in the Senate end Donald Trump’s chances of running again? What will the 2024 election even look like? All this and more.

About Dave Rubin: http://rubinreport.comall right people it is january 22nd 2021 i'm dave rubin this is the reuben report direct message we are streaming live from los angeles on youtube and on blaze tv and we're doing another panel show this week we've we've done one of these and you guys dug it and i dug it so we said we're gonna do it again because we're people pleasers around here joining me today for the panel are dr seb gorka who's the former deputy assistant to the president and host of america first i'll be on his show a little bit later today uh sean spicer who's the former white house communications director and host of spicer and company on newsmax i don't think i'm on that today but i'm on all the time and jack murphy author of democrat to deplorable and founder of liminal order and a guy i've wanted on the show forever so gentlemen welcome to the reuben report thanks for having me happy friday all right let's start with the doctor dr gorka because uh you've got doctor in front of you and if jill biden's a doctor we're all doctors uh the reason i wanted to have the 3u on basically is because not only did you and sean work in the administration but jack has a similar political evolution as me he was a democrat for a long time i jack i'll let you speak for yourself but basically i think you're a conservative at this point or at least sort of a a non-democrat let's say uh and i thought bringing the three of you guys on to discuss what the future of this thing is would be interesting gorka what do you think the future of the republicans is is it is it a trump future or are they going back to all the other guys well i'll tell you one thing it better not be a third party dave so um that would be a disaster that's how we got bill clinton when ross perot ran uh against uh clinton and split the conservative vote uh look i i listened to my my sources uh i had one of the new freshman congresswoman on my show lauren bobbitt who's already created quite a name for herself who said on my show america first this is donald trump's party now i don't know what he's gonna do in 2024 i was there at andrews air force base with sean uh on uh the morning of the inauguration we saw the president saw the first lady and he said right there in front of us i will in one shape or form or another i will be back now whether he runs or not i don't know but for the foreseeable future he will be the conservative king maker not only that the mega movement it's not just about him it's about what he came to represent it was remarkable well i saw it with my own eyes so did shawn this is a man who appealed across all class structures across all demographics when you go to youngstown ohio steel valley and you see people from the steel industry former democrats whose grandparents were democrats screaming you know america first america first usa that's like reagan and that that has changed conservative politics uh inexorably so the the gop establishment the mitch mcconnell type establishment i think is dead god bless donald trump for doing that yeah i'm kind of with you on that and and whatever this thing becomes it has to be bigger than one man sean since uh since he chose you at one time to to represent his thoughts trump's thoughts that is to to the people um do you think whatever this movement now is uh that is that we're all being told we all have to be deprogrammed and de-platformed and the rest of it um can it survive without trump does it does it actually need the man or can the ideas of it survive i mean it can't survive sure but i would just say that steps right i mean if it goes the way of a third party that's disaster um and it literally guarantees a democratic majority going forward for a generation parties are bigger than just ideas they're about mechanics they're about getting on ballots and and um and we've seen this with the green party and the libertarian party whatever there's a reason that we have a two-party system and part of it is just because there there's an there's an apparatus uh that is necessary to get on all 50 states ballots and to be organized and and to run the imaginations of this but to get to your question whether he plays king maker candidate that's up to donald trump to decide uh for himself but what trump represented is he tapped into this feeling and sediment that existed in america and though it's it still exists there were 75 million people who voted for him um and so if you're a smart politician you should look at what he did and what he represented and say hey i get that there are people out there that think washington ignores them that don't think that washington gets the issues and the concerns that they have and i want to tap into it you don't need to be like trump trump is trump let him do it but politicians need to understand that what what made trump trump was an authenticity and an understanding of the struggles that people go through and you can't fake that yeah can i add to something very briefly so and exactly what sean said let's remember one thing i mean quite stunning that despite the calumny despite the libel of the last four years where 24 7 he was called a misogynist a white supremacist an islamophobe and then a nazi literally a nazi he got 10 million more votes than he did four years ago and that's not because of mitch that's not because of kevin mccarthy that's because of donald trump's message so the fact that he got more votes than any other president is the determining factor not his personage but the message of making america great again so jack as the new guy to the party literally and figuratively i i feel like you've had a pretty good handle on uh like sort of the underbelly of the internet side of this just what's going on that kind of average people are saying on twitter and on youtube and the rest of it what do you make of the situation yeah my you know my perspective is definitely more grassroots than these other two gentlemen for sure and i think the first thing i want to talk about is just remembering that maga is an emergent network it is a phenomenon that bubbled up from the people and and the network elected donald trump to represent that network and that energy and that energy still survives the the maga energy the moga network that launched donald trump into power is still here and the democrats acknowledge that i mean whether or not what they did with the the armed truth capital was justified on a security level or justified in their mind on an info-op level they recognized the need to make a strong display uh in the face of 75 million people who did support the president and do support that that the maga energy now my question is uh to the other two panelists to seb and sean here is you know is trump really in charge of the gop i don't see it when when i was when i was looking at the stage in 2016 looking at the primaries i saw him defeat 17 of the gop but i think the gop defeated donald trump while he was in office and i don't see him taking over the gop as it stands i still see him contra the gop and still battling the gop which is really just the uniparty and that's what the maga energy was all about fighting back against the corporate uniparty in cahoots with the democrats and the gop establishment plus the corporations black lives matter and for a moment there uh antifa as well but that's what needs to happen here in the future i think yeah so that's a good point it's something i've been talking about all week that what we saw really is just that the swamp just kind of reconstituted itself that the swamp just kind of loves itself so sean as a guy that lives in dc you've been around the swamp for a long time when you see guys like mitch mcconnell sort of reconstituting the swamp and now saying maybe he'll be for impeachment which it's like just let the guy leave at this point that would be my opinion like we've if there's anything that's going to be healing in this country which i'm not sure there actually is it's like it would start without it would start by not doing a post-presidency impeachment but but what do you make of what jack just said there that that the whole machinery is still not part of what trump is so it's like the republicans sort of still are against him in a way yeah i think jack's got a really good point and that was the beauty of it that trump tapped into the sediment that existed out there and was able to harness it and defeat all these folks and but that's my point though is that i think jack's right but if you're a smart leader which apparently not all of them seem to be that smart that that they should understand that he tapped into something look seb made the point if trump wasn't doing what people wanted his vote goal would go down in fact it went up that would tell anybody on the republican side hey he was tapping into something and it was something that was growing so don't be a dummy understand how to do what he was doing to to tap into the sediment to understand the concerns and the issues that he was championing and actually continue to move forward on them um because i i will say this he did shape some things though you think about the policy on trade right the the republican party has generally been fairly you know just unabashedly free trade trump made people reconsider this and say yes you can be for you know fair trade and open trade with restrictions and we're not giving the house away this idea of putting america first made sense to people once they thought about it but for so long literally decades we have been told well unfortunately that's the way it has to be what trump showed whether his domestic policy or foreign policy was like screw that we can actually do it a different way and achieve better results so i i just i i agree with i will say this that the leaders in congress need to understand that if they want to go back to the ways that they were they can do that and maybe that will last for two or four years but they are holding the water back in a dam that is going to crumble on them yeah that i completely agree with it's like the cat is out of the bag you know this thing has whatever is happening in this country like no one no one buys the swamp thing anymore seb if if trump just goes to mar-a-lago and is just like you know what i gave it all i got i got i don't want to do this anymore or or at least i don't want to run maybe i'll if they let me back on twitter i'll do what i can on that front or i'll do some public events um who's there is there somebody that you're tracking is there a young star that's coming like who who is on the docket i don't see it you know i just don't see the bench some people talk about cotton some people talk about gates some people talk about uh a greg abbott i just don't see it because they're all politicians to a lesser or greater extent the re i mean let's just remember one thing what happened in 2016. now we forget this it is truly historic for the first time in the republic's history we chose a non-politician and a non-swarm dweller from george washington to barack obama every single one of the 44 presidents of our republic was either a retired general a former governor a senator a congressman for the first time ever we picked a non-politician who'd never run for public office before and that is the future they don't want somebody they've seen in front of the tv cameras reading from teleprompters for the last four or 16 years and to be clear to what jack's point i said it when i was in the white house i said it since i left the white house and they don't like me in the swamp for saying it but it is it is patently obvious that donald trump became president despite the gop not thanks to the gop and the idea that mitch mcconnell is acquiescing to this trial of a private citizen is an outrage and the establishment gop four years later still doesn't understand what happened in 2016 and they will pay a political penalty if they don't wake up and smell the coffee grinds jack what do you think is is going on in the minds of the people that are you know everyone's political now which is a very bizarre thing that everyone is hyper political and obsessed by it all the time and i think that's partly why everyone is so crazy and angry but what do you make of like the people that are the new ones to politics like i know you went to some of the rallies i was at the rally and a couple of them in beverly hills and what i liked about it was not only that people were happy and fun but it was clear that these are not political people these were people who were just like oh there's something kind of cool and fun happening here what do you think those people are thinking right now yeah i think that i think to just follow up on what's being said recently that the trump was defeated by the gop in in his term while he was president the biggest obstacle he faced was the gop was staffing was having loyal people uh to carry out his plans at any of the any of the agencies in the government and so he lost the gop the gop is still in power the democrats are still in power the corporate unit party's still in power and so who's going to be next what's next is somebody who can bring the power that is necessary to circumvent the political parties and to capture the party in the same way that trump did so i would look to somebody in the future who is already bringing with them a network power somebody that has their own built-in communications and distribution system who understands persuasion who has contacts across the country in every industry and has a brand people with outside brands have to come in and take over the political apparatus in the same way that trump did but again that will also lead to additional infighting and obstruction and derailment of that candidate's agenda so that is something that we have to deal with right there that that contradiction yeah so so i'm actually with you i'm with you on that but so are you talking about like it's not this person specifically but are you saying someone like it has to be someone like elon musk like it has to be like someone who is really extraordinarily connected and powerful and has done all this stuff before in terms of building things and all that or you mean you mean like a youtuber like like what do you actually mean i mean somebody that can bring the power to bear that's necessary to communicate directly with the american people to get elected through a popular election and then somehow be able to implement their network on top of or in place of the gop institution because this is the institutions that are the issue we need new networks to battle the captured institutions okay this is let's go sorry go ahead uh sean go ahead you were trying to get in there no i just the one thing that i was going to say that that you know and i don't want to take this off off the track but i i think the problem with this party is that they've got to understand what trump showed i always said what what what was unique about trump is in washington dc there's three power centers right you have the the lobbyists the journalists and the sort of the the pundits and elites that have always been used to no matter who was the next person in line always got sucked up to and trump basically during the campaign said listen here's the deal i don't need you i don't need your money and i don't need you writing about me if you want to jump on the bandwagon you're welcome to but you know i don't need you that was the first time that frankly anybody has said that there is a default in the republican party right now that i've witnessed for 30 years and frankly to some degree you know may have flirted with this myself until i recognize but that people want to be accepted they want the new york times to write a puff piece about them they want to get invited to the cocktail parties and as soon as folks on the right recognize that's never going to happen and it's something that donald trump enlightened us on that if we realize it's never gonna happen they will never accept us they will never like us they will never bring us into that fold and that we need to be you know okay with that and say screw it i don't need to do that once we understand that i think we as a party can move in the right direction but there is such a degree of the republican party that wants to be accepted by this left-wing elite class that rules the social circuit in the the media circuit in dc yeah for the record i have completely given up on being invited to nice parties i am i am past the point of parties and the rest of it and i'm also locked in my house here in la so that's a whole other thing but let's talk about the the social media component of this can i can i just jump on this for a second because this is a massive massively important i feel i feel like i'm doing a vulcan mind meld with jack and sean so it is stunning um that this phenomenon still exists when when i was in the white house and sean and i were were the weird guys we were the oddities because we didn't want the establishment to say nice stuff about us i mean i said you know if the washington post ever says something nice about sebastian gorka i'm failing i am utterly failing because they're committed to the destruction of this president and his agenda so you know they want to be loved they were people at my rank deputy assistant to the president which is pretty high there's 40 people of that rank in the us are in the u.s government we outrank three-star generals i knew people at my rank dave who were never trumpers inside the white house who were there because they wanted the tick on the resume but were actively trying to undermine the president so this this is this question of bench and team i mean jack is right that he has to be an outsider and a celebrity but it has to be somebody who can fill four thousand political appointments us government so i mean so one last thing on that though is then is that in your opinion is that was that trump's fault like was that his greatest fault is that he did not get rid of the right people when he was supposed to get rid of him no no no it's not that he didn't get rid of them he didn't have anybody to fill those positions when we came in i went to work the day after the inauguration saturday january the 21st 8 a.m and and you know we came into the building and i'm not joking it's not an exaggeration there were about maybe 20 guys in senior positions guys and gals and i mean senior positions who knew what maga meant were loyal to magga not the man but to the message make america great again and had the wherewithal to actually make something happen then there was this gap and there were like dozens and dozens and hundreds of 23 year olds and then there was nobody else there was no bench we were a small group of merry men it was like robin hood's insurgency took off the took over the us government thanks to the american people and then we had to fill these positions and what happened and i'm gonna let the you know the dirty laundry out here we had to fill thousands of positions and what happened the bushy schlep came in and filled the vacuum the former bush appointees or people who weren't competent came in for those 4 000 positions where else would donald trump get that team and this is a massive problem for the next four years we must build the bench on the outside and it can't come from these stinking think tanks of so-called elitist you know experts here in dc yeah so that i think gets to jack's point about you got to have a network and you're going to have to have done a lot of stuff before the next guy comes in but let's talk about the the information war here in the social media component of this because there are an awful lot of mainstream people right now on in new york times cnn katie couric that we've been covering all this stuff all these people that's saying that are saying that guys like us we're spreading misinformation we should be de-platformed we should be banned we should take out newsmax we should be kicked off youtube there was a big article now about podcasts or the next frontier on this thing that we should all be silenced um jack i know you're you're sort of on the ground on this thing it's like are they going to come for everybody i mean we're all feeling it january 6 was a day that sort of settled it said in stone that uh there was a insurgency we now gone from being uh nazis and racists to being domestic terrorists uh we know that uh the democrats are going to look at not only are they they're on an eradication mission in the first place so they're just looking for an excuse to double down on what they wanted to do in the first place which is to get rid of us which is to make sure quote that this never happens again and that's what that big display was around the inauguration that the big display of force they want to come for us they're going to come for us and my advice to people is to take your head off the chopping block of social media find a private network get involved put up a barrier between you and the rest of the people keep your head down and build deep roots we are in a reconsolidation period at least for this first year here uh coming out of the four years of trump we don't know exactly what's going to happen with the censorship and the online stuff so my advice to everybody is to find a network a private network build your own in network be intentional with your relationships and your associations put up a wall and keep the people out that you want to keep out and put the people inside that you want to put inside and make sure it's based on your shared values and i think that that is a way to at least move forward for the time being you could call it something like locals right yeah well i think i think jack i think you yeah well i think you mean it both you mean it physically like in your actual real world life remember that real world life thing but i think you mean it also also digitally sean are you kind of worried that they could just come and take out newsmax it's like in the old days it was like all right i'm not an independent guy so they can take out all the small fish they can knock out some random youtubers that's one thing but now they're literally talking about going after oann going after newsmax you know getting licenses taken away and the rest of it do you feel like you have extra protections right now no i mean i i if you had asked me this question six weeks ago eight weeks ago i would i would think that that was it was a nutty question uh but in light of what's happened the conversation that's occurred over the last seven to ten days yeah i'm really worried i think we've gotten to the point where um i mean the idea that you look at a network and a network that is on these you know major stations it's pulling in close to a million people a night and they go yeah we don't like what's being said and by the way the thing that's funny is is that they never give the example they said newsmax is is just you know is part of the disinformation campaign i'm like okay tell me one thing that's been on my show um you know conversations with you and other people about news of the day that somehow they just don't even like the topics they're like but but wait i just what i don't get though dave and this is what's fascinating yesterday for example cnn 23 times said that the administration the incoming administration was not left a vaccine plan none and that they had to quote start from scratch dr fauci himself came out and said that that was not true cnn just moved on why aren't we talking about deep platforming cnn well because cnn is owned by att what is att owned they own time water and directv these guys that hold the keys in the corporate headquarters there is no doubt in my mind they're gonna get woke over and over again to the idea of canceling out stop allowing people to do this cancel out advertisers it's coming and i am worried yeah and the best is when you see how obvious their coordination is so the messaging coming out of cnn on all their twitter accounts yesterday was the trump team was handed a non-existent plan that's what they all kept saying but you can't be handed something that's non-existent i mean that's not even it doesn't even make any sense on top of the fact that we know that something like 17 million people have gotten the vaccination and the states are doing a lot of it and all that stuff uh seb i'm guessing you're worried too although you don't strike me as a particularly nervous type of guy but you're worried about the hammer dropping on on all of us in terms of our ability to communicate i look it's gonna happen sooner or later but i don't lose sleep over it you know it's easy for me when you got a dad who you know had the scars on his body till his dying day of of the torture that the secret police did to him in a in a dictatorial regime before he escaped from a political prison i just bring it you bastards just bring it because sooner or later those types of regimes and i mean regimes fail and when you've got 74 million people who voted for a man who believes in america who loves america and who believes in freedom of speech who didn't spy on american journalists like obama did didn't put journalists in their sources in prison then sooner or later there will be a backlash and this isn't a threat it's a fact i taught for six years irregular warfare and counterinsurgency for the defense department and when you silence people with true grievances sooner or later something will occur and the idea that we're going to run and hide from it is utterly un-american and and you're right there is a coordination here remember michelle obama michelle obama writes a two-page letter that donald trump should be d-platformed and 72 hours later he is deleted he's unpersoned by jack dorsey and then we see the video from the twitter meeting thanks to veritas project saying jack's saying if this isn't just about one account this is about lots of accounts and it's going to last a long time you've experienced it i've lost 100 000 followers in 10 days but do i give up do we do it do we give up no we persevere because sooner or later more and more americans even in the middle the a most americans are apolitical we'll see the fascistic tendencies of the democrat party and we'll understand what you understood when you left the democrats that this is not your daddy's great democrat party this is not your granddaddy's democrat party and it is now a bunch of radicals who are hostage to their own radical extremism well that's a perfect segue to jack here because you wrote the book democrat to deplorable what do you make of the people that we used to hang out with all the time because they're not all bad i know they're not all bad we all know that they're not all bad but i have been if there's one group that i'm just supremely disappointed with right now it's it's my old crew it's the last few remaining decent liberals who i saw celebrating i mean many of them who've been on this show celebrating the censorship of donald trump what do you make of that crew at this point it's it's tough man in the 90s you know i was counter culture in washington dc i like to do underground parties and i was anti-establishment and as i grew up i think i retained that and what i see from my old friends that are all still democrats they they think they're anti-establishment but they are the establishment now and they're and they're just not aware of the fact and they've lost all of their rebel or punk attitude that they